50 Shades Trilogy

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shay2, I definitely agree. He did want more almost from the beginning. But with no experience with "more" he didn't know how to go about it. He was so confused with what he was feeling. When she left I think he realized just how much he wanted "more." And that his life as he knew it was changed forever.

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And yes I like your way. It is more romantic.

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2shay I think in his effed up mind somehow he associated the beatings with love. He thought she beat him b/c she loved him. If he misbehaved she beat him b/c she wanted to teach him how to behave b/c she loved him. He was obsessed Ana's safety. If she did something dangerous he wanted to teach her it was wrong. And I think too that it was some kind of payback/revenge. Like he said he was 50 shades of fucked up.

Oh & thank you for the nice compliments. I don't know how accurate they are but thank you very much. It's so nice to have a real discussion with intelligent people. Some people I know could learn from this group.

You have no idea yet how great this group is! I "heard" Fae speaking when you were talking about how many things might have been different with a good editing! Fae catches more writing and editing errors....! It's so much fun to see her in action. You will meet everyone eventually. If you start posting about Adrien English you will be overwhelmed with meeting everyone. That is pretty much on everyone's favorites list. Number one for many! We all love talking about Adrien.

I don't see how someone could not react to Adrien one way or another.

The Adrien English books are another series that is tons of fun to discuss!

Hey y'all!!! I read the 50 Shades trilogy a few days ago in about a week's time and I kept meaning to post here as I did and I just kept forgetting.... bad Floozie!!! spank me now!!
OK so where to start.... I didn't love the books and from what I saw of some of your posts Shay I was almost tempted to stop (especially during book 2) at times but I think for different reasons. Oh and before I get sidetracked, even with all my negative comments overall I really enjoyed the books and thought they were really entertaining.

So what bothered me the most was the repetition it just got annoying a lot of the times and felt my own eyes roll and wanted to bite Ana's bottom lip clean off!! Also as SB said I found issues with Christian's behavior not so much in the bedroom (I am a B/D and D/S fan not so much S/M) but it was how he treated Ana and spoke to her that I found grating and abusive. He took the Edward stalker tendencies to a whole new level and was just too overbearing and immature. The BDSM didn't bother me because in my opinion it could barely be categorized as BDSM... or I guess it could be, my problem was more of Christian as a Dominant; it just wasn't believable to me. I think the "kinky fuckery" was a much more apt description of their role playing.

There were so many things disturbing to me about Christian's behavior... but ultimately I think that's what made the story so compelling!! The fact that he chose all his submissives on the basis that they reminded him of the "crack whore" Lord have mercy Freud would have a field day with this guy!! I think that's the payback/punishment he was trying to impose on the submissives was for his mom's offenses and Elena just gave him the tools to do it.

I agree with readerchic that I hope the story completely ends where it did; it was an absolutely satisfying ending where all the issues were resolved. And I definitely wouldn't want to be in Christian's head, he definitely would have my blood pressure up with his memories and reactions.

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2shay, Fae & I will get along great. I find every little mistake in books too. Whether it's consistency with the story line or grammar. And it's ironic b/c I could really use an editor in my everyday communication. I am forever using the words saw & seen and was & were incorrectly. And my southern drawl is so bad people say I make one syllable words into two syllables. My "southern english" is horrible. There was a book I read a couple of years ago that was had so many mistakes it made me cringe. Missing punctuation, misspelled words, incomplete sentences & sentences that didn't make sense, and I won't even get started on the consistency. And this was a best selling author. The book was the 10th in a very popular series. One of several of her very popular series. I wasn't the only one that noticed either. I saw tons of complaints about it & even some pretty bad reviews b/c of it. Some people said that they thought maybe the wrong copy got sent to the printers. It was really bad. And then not long after that a book from one of her other series came out & it was missing an entire scene. She had to post the scene on her website for people to read. Hopefully after all that she has hired an editor or a new editor.

sabby, I have said several times that the series could be cut in half if they would take out all the repetition. Ana mentioning Christian's looks & hair and the things you mentioned. And everything they said was "whispered." Did they ever speak in a normal voice? I think some of Christian's behavior was that he just simply didn't know how to behave. He was in a situation he had never been in before & never thought he would be in. He was confused & like his doctor said, emotionally he was an adolescent. I'm not excusing some of the things he done. I just think that since he has only known D/s it will take a while to get used to not being like that. I do think that he loved Ana with all his heart & he just needed time to figure out how to deal with that. I've also said from the beginning that I wouldn't call it erotica or BDSM. I'd say it was a hot, steamy romance with some kink or BDSM elements. And even though there was parts I didn't like I think that everything that happened was necessary for the story to make such an impact on people.

Hey, Sabby! I am glad you finally enjoyed the book. If you've read through, you can tell that I loved it.

50 Shades

Elena knew Christian's mother, and knew his issues. She, being a practicing Domme, knew how to use that to her advantage. She seduces a 15 year old boy who is already fucked up beyond any help that his smart, well-educated and wealthy parents can get for him. She takes a 15 years old straight into a submissive role and spends the better part of the next 6 years beating the shit out of him. Fifty Shades Of Fucked Up.

OH I forgot to mention my absolute favorite thing about the book, it was the E-MAILS!!!! I thought they were fantastic. It seemed an extremely realistic manner in which not only a young couple would communicate starting up a new relationship; but certainly these two. Enabling Ana to be more forthcoming with her concerns and issues and Christian also to be more open. And of course they were just to dang funny!! The additions to his CEO title and the subject headings I loved all of it!!

And as I said before even though I had major issues with Christians behavior, I understand that's what made the story so compelling. To see his journey and struggles to come to understand real love was beautiful with its poignant moments of edness!! I did want to slap him silly quite often and probably wanted to hug him and console him the other half...... and of course be willing to sign any dam contract he wanted me too!!!

OMG and don't even get me started on Elena, 2Shay!!! That women was a deplorable character that needs to be hit by a bus posthaste!!!! I just meant that she taught Christian a way to deal out "punishment" to his submissives; but in no way was I condoning what she did to him. I think it was great how he finally understood how Ana felt about Elena only after he could envision his own child in that situation. I cant even imagine what his mom would have done if she found out the extent of Elena's predatory behavior against her son.

Sabby---

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Elena taught him sexual violence as a coping mechanism. There are things said during the story. At some point he bacame a "switch", if you know what that means, although he didn't use that term. He told Ana that Elena had subed for him. So.....what does that mean? He was getting tired of being her sub?...not sure. But, there is so much more. He learned to Dom in the clubs around Seattle. He never had to bring his subs home. He wanted someone in his life. He thought he wanted his subs, but none of them lasted long. 15 in about 7 years. Some of them only lasted a month or so, some longer. Leila was the longest. He KNEW that Ana wasn't a practicing submissive, and he knew where he could find another sub willing to sign whatever contract he wanted. I am convinced that he was done with it, he just didn't know how to find his way out. It was all he knew. He was in a terrible struggle. I don't think a 15 year old boy can ever be said to "consent". So.....even though at some point he became an active participant, he never "consented" to be in "the lifestyle". Christian was really smart in so many ways, but this wasn't something he could think through. Elena should have gone to jail as a child molester. Even after the fact. No amount of money that she "loaned" Christian to start his money could make up for what she did.

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I can't think of anyone in any book I hated more than Mrs. Robinson. She made my blood boil. She's a pedophile, child molester crazy bitch. Christian had already been through so much & then for her to do what she did. OMG! Now, I'm a country girl & Charlie Daniels is one if my favorite singers. I have to agree with the lyrics of one of his songs, Simple Man. Sometimes jail is just too good for some people. Here's what he suggests ~~

As far as I'm concerned there ain't no excuse
For the raping and the killing and the child abuse
And I've got a way to put an end to all that mess

Just take them rascals out in the swamp
Put 'em on their knees and tie 'em to a stump
Let the rattlers and the bugs and the alligators do the rest

Why, readerchic, I am shocked. Just shocked at the violent attitude! Yep. Me too! There have been a few fictional characters I wanted to kill, Black Jack Randall comes to mind right away, but none more than Elena Lincoln.

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HA! When I think about what that poor boy went through I want to kill her slowly with my bare hands. I'm only 5 feet tall but I think I could tear her apart. I know I've complained about the writing & lack of editing a lot but anyone that can put my emotions through the wringer like she did has to have some kind of something special. I even have to wonder if an editor had gotten a hold of it would it have been as good. I just don't know. The main thing that irritated me was the repetition by Ana. I don't remember seeing a ton of grammar mistakes like in that one book I read by the best selling author.

Hello gals!

Spoilers

Hey Shay! Sorry it has taken me so long to post, but I couldn't find the thread. I am lost on this site now as I am not the most technological person and I give up easily if I can't find something. Sabby informed me today on how I can find this thread by name now, so here I am.

Unfortunately, I found a lot of grammatical mistakes in each book and the word "brought" was spelled as "bought" two times in the series that had me shaking my head. However, that said - I could care less as I enjoyed the series!

The first book was my favorite as Anna was such a strong character that didn't take shit from anyone. The second book she was such a "Bella" and doing whatever it takes for her man (mind - you I would have caved as well , and in the third book she was back to not taking any shit which I loved.

I would love to know for sure when Elena was a sub for Christian. Since he repeats time and time again in the book that his relationship with her lasted six years, I would imagine that it was somewhere in his 6th or possibly 5th year that it took place. He would have been 21 or 22 at the time - feeling more confident about being an adult and making his own choices/starting his company that he felt it was time to take back control of his life and therefore wanting to be a Dom at that point. JMO

I hate Elena as much as I hate Leghair! Even though both of them are minor characters in their respecitive series and have very few lines, their actions speak volumes and the impact that they both have on the major characters is significant. Elena's actions were reprehensive, but still not on the Jack Randall level (he is one f*cked up individual with varied tastes).

Spoilers

I also thought Christian was never a true "Dom" as Mrs. Robinson subjected him to the lifestyle (as Shay stated above), it wasn't his choice.

It was Anna herself that brought out him wanting something more than a D/S relationship. At the end of the 3rd book, when we are reading Christian's point of view, he is contemplating asking Anna out on a date when he tracks her down in the hardware store that she works. He just didn't understand his feelings as he had never felt that way before. He was used to Mrs. R or paying for subs (even the ones with the contract - he paid for them - it was just not as crude as directly paying for sex at the clubs he frequented).

So, in the end true love conquers all yet again - even in BDSM relationships.

Spoilers

Now that I think about it, I think Anna was topping from the bottom from the very beginning when she first met Christian.

Christian is used to having women do as he asks because of his looks and money

Anna turned him down and/or had the upperhand in the following:

- declined his offer of touring of his company on their first meeting
- he kissed her in the elevator without her signing anything ("F*ck the paperwork!")
- he deflowered her and he had never had a virgin before let alone someone who was not into the BDSM lifestyle
- said he couldn't make love or know how to be gentle (but was able to on the 2nd or 3rd time they sealed the deal on their 1st night together at his home
- all of the other firsts they did together (LOVED the Cartier charm bracelet he gave her as reminder)
- meeting his parents/family
- turning him down when he was feeling her up under the table at his parents home
- and the list goes on, too many to put all here - but you get my drift

Anna has had control of Christian from the very beginning, she just doesn't know it.

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Autumn.....waving wildly! Yes! And...and.....have you thought about the significance of the cars? First...the Audi A3 Submissive Special! After Leila trashed it, they were driving around the day they went to the marina and it's the first time he heard Ana refer to it as the Submissive Special. He immediately went to the Saab dealer and got her a good bit classier car! ....still considered one of the safest in the world. Then she drove his R8 Spyder very well in the chase scene and got them out of harms way, and laughingly told him she wanted one! And for her birthday? He gives her an R8 Spyder! Not a safe car by any stretch! In the same class and price range as a Lamborginni! He declared her his total equal! Equality by car! He knew he wasn't her Dom, and she was never his sub! If you stay within the BDSM terminology, and this is a stretch, they were both switches! Frankly, that isn't even right. They were just a young, very happily sexual couple. If you haven't clued in from some of my earlier posts, Ana was almost as messed up as Christian. At the very least she had an eating disorder with very low self esteem. At worst, she was harassed or molested by her mother's third husband, Steve. She really, really didn't believe she would ever have anyone if she didn't take Christian up on his offer, and she really, really didn't believe, as she told Dr. Flynn, that he would want her if he wasn't so messed up. Two damaged young people who find their way together. sigh I loved this story.

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Hey Shay!

I didn't fully appreciate the significance of the cars for Anna until you pointed that out. Good call.

Anna definitely had self-esteem issues, but I don't think she had an eating disorder. When I was her age, I would forget to eat as I was so caught up with the stress of my job. Boy, I wish I still felt like that now! I could see the stress of her relationship with Christian causing her not to have an appetite.

I didn't see her not thinking she couldn't have anyone if she didn't take Christian up on his offer. I think she felt the sexual heat and was interested in him since their first meeting - but didn't know how to act on it as she had never been in a relationship before. Not to mention, she had to be intimitated by his wealth and his position as she had a meager upbringing and she didn't want to feel like a "ho" by accepting his generous gifts. And, possibly seeing her mom with so many men had an impact on her not dating as she saw what her mother went through with men.

I agree they were a young, happy, and sexually active couple that like "kinky fuckery." I just don't like to dwell on how Christian's sexpertise came to be. Ick! And, who knows, maybe Christian and Anna eventually did go the full monte on the BDSM as she pretty much gave him full reign at the end of the third book and he said something like he wanted to test her limitations. Anna just needed some time to ease into that sexual lifestyle.

Hey Ms. Leaves!!!!

Yeah Elena and her actions are horrific!! I've been thinking maybe E.L chose that name taking yet from another series CH/TB; who was "senior" to the supposed noble man she turned and corrupted-Bill.

And it makes sense that Christian for all intense and purposes was never a "true Dom" as Autumn and Shay said. I think as I was reading I just didn't think about how he became involved in the lifestyle... one because it really was traumatic and two I think I took it a little to personally that only a "damaged" person could be involved in BDSM behavior.

It is curious how elaborate his setup/submissive contracts were..... I think aside from the Dom behavior he had a little OCD going to and dang for all the perks I would sign!!! Submissive special, beautiful Penthouse room, clothes!! It definitely showed how Christian had to learn and change gears when he was with Ana that there needed to be "more" than just mind blowing kinky fuckery and lavish gifts!! I forgot to mention all the firsts too... it was very romantic!! And it helped to keep them on a more balanced level, so that Ana wasn't the only novice in the relationship Christian in his own way was just as new.

I don't think Ana was necessarily a anorexic like Autumn said just a young college student with no real sense of nutrition. But there was definitely something very odd about that third husband that they NEVER talked about.... very alarming!! Now that you brought it up considering the story was from her POV I'm surprised we didn't get more back story. I wish instead of so much repetition she would've had more sessions with Dr. Flynn not only to discuss Christian but her own life as well it might of helped to make her character a little more dynamic.

I do think the prologue was great and showed how far they have come and that now they both had complete trust of eachother to continue to pursue each of their limits and could fully enjoy all the kinky fuckery and live happily ever after!!!

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Autumn and Sabby......I didn't see anything in this story to indicate that everyone involved in BDSM is in some way twisted. Christian was abused and brought into it when he was way too young to "consent". Elena was a monster. However, Christian, Dom or sub, was never a monster. Dr. Flynn explained things in a very good way about Christian's pathology.

I still say that Ana had an eating disorder. Probably not full out anorexia! I thought her low self-esteem was a pretty good clue. Self-esteem and eating issues go hand and hand. She didn't have any real taste or interest in clothes. Her first meeting with Christian she was dressed in a pretty drab way...he noticed. For anything pretty, she had to borrow from Kate. Third husband probably had something to do with it. Verbal abuse? Telling her she was ugly, fat, undesirable ....I don't know because she had him totally blocked, I don't think she COULD think about him. When she asked Dr. Flynn if Christian would even be interested in her if he wasn't so messed up, what else did she say?....just look at him, and look at me.....She did not think she was pretty enough, sexy enough....whatever. I have no way of knowing if my next point has any merit because Ana has blocked all thoughts of "Steve"......no gag reflex while giving her very first (?????) blow job. Christian commented on it......"do you have no gag reflex, at all"...! Hmmmmmm........that ain't right. I think there is at least some evidence that she was at the least verbally humiliated. Possibly molested, but I won't insist on that. She seemed to try to avoid attention.

Another little side issue. Kate. Beautiful, blond, bossy, dynamic....Kate. It could be as simple as living with someone so ....well,.....flamboyantly gorgeous and outgoing. Maybe.

In case anyone is interested, I looked it up. What Dr. Flynn told Ana was true. Sadism is no longer listed as a mental disorder or disease. Sexual sadism is now considered a lifestyle choice except in cases where it is used against a non-consenting adult. (Elena's seduction of Christian). In those cases it is considered a serious and dangerous mental disease as well as a criminal offense. Sexual sadism is considered one of the factors in violent rape, murders and serial killings. Local BDSM clubs is one of the very first places law enforcement looks at those types of crimes. Interesting. Also explains why Christian wanted contracts with his subs. Any lack of. or question of consent can quickly become criminal.

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I think I can speak for both Sabby and me (we've had several phone conversations on Shades) in that we in no way meant that anyone involved in BDSM was twisted or morally corrupt.
We were just stating that Christian didn't choose the BDSM lifestyle - Mrs. R forced him as a minor into it (i.e, not his choice). Who's to say he wouldn't have gone down the BDSM path on his own without Mrs. R, but she was his driving factor.

I for one think anything that whatever consenting adults do sexually is fine by me (excluding involvement of animals).

And, in regards to Anna's form of dress - she was a poor college student. Kate was a rich girl with access to fashion. Anna borrowed from Kate when she wanted to impress Christian and/or for events such as graduation. Anna's stepdad felt bad when he found out Anna borrowed her graduation dress from Kate. JMO - but I think she didn't want to ask him or her mom for the money for a dress when she could borrow from Kate knowing Kate wouldn't mind (saving them the expense).

It is possible that Anna was molested and/or mistreated by stepdad #3, but like Sabby - I found it odd that since the story was told from Anna's POV, she didn't inform Christian of it. This could have been a way for them to bond with both of them being molested as children. I just think Anna didn't get along with hubby number 3 and loved hubby #2 and just didn't want to get caught up in mom's drama. But, anything is possible.

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In regards to gag reflex, maybe she is just one of the lucky ones? Or, maybe she is channeling her inner "Anita." or Anita's lover, Cousin It

JMO, but I think the no gag reflex was written to "shock" readers.

Lastly, Chrisitan asks if she has ever given a BJ, and she replies no. I don't think Anna is a good liar, and if she lied - Christian would have been able to tell that she had and reacted.

Part of me can't wait for the next Anita book just to see how stupid it will be.