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ferdy



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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:48 am

I find RM's series start of better then get progressively worse.. and I also find that I like and respect her heroines at the start of the series than the end because they just regress and make huuugge mistakes.. but yet I still love her books (mostly) no idea
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Starbrites

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 1:42 pm

Well, I am 55% into the book and I have to be completely honest it's been pretty boring. She's pregnant and she can't fight so of course there is no battles or anything else for that matter. Then she decides that hiding in the human world would be better for her and the babies and Roland finds her a place to stay with a couple of friends of his. There very nice people. The couples nephew I think he is hangs out with Eug alot and he seems nice enough. Which I think if RM does not let her be with Dorian then she will have hewr end up with him which I don't think would be such a bad thing. He was nice enough and wasn't pushy to her and was more then happy like the rest of that family to just love and except her and the babies. Anyhow, She has the babies early and they have to stay in the hospital but Roland returns and says that the otherworld is in big trouble and that she is needed for the help. She leaves her babies in the care of the hospital and the family she was staying with and heads on over to help fix this winter problem. They head to try to save the otherworld when that fox shows up to "help" them out. Dorian asked him to come. ugh! They fight 1 huge snowman as i call it and then they ride on. Where I just left off they were being attacked in a nice and calm way by a dryad. like a tree whore. I don't have a clue. They make you feel all happy and nice but to men they take away your awareness. You there but not. And now Eug and Jasmine are trying to figure out how to get the men to basically come back to life.

As far as I am concerned the reading fast going i think cause I am waiting for something to actually happen. All I wrote above is like 200 pages worth is my guess sense I read that this was like a 400 page book. Alot of nothing for 55% if you ask me.

I know on FB showme you said you were not going to read so I thought to give you a little summary. It's not much of one sense there is NOTHING going on. I can only hope things pick up. I will keep posting if and when there is something to post about. I do have to say I am a little disappointed that it's going so slow and boring. Not that I mind the whole day to day thing but where is this going to lead too? hmmm. only time will tell.
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showmethelove
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 3:05 pm

Thanks Starbrites hugs I really appreciate that. I love Dorian and use to like the series but IC was pure shit IMO. Please keep update me on the second half of the book. Looking forward to your thoughts. smile
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:53 pm

I haven't read this series....the bad reviews for IC have kept me away!

But I hate the plot device of the absent parents or children. Parents seem to be absent from YA books a lot, and the reasons for the parents absence is almost always lame. It's a pet peeve of mine.

I guess the adult-genre equivalent is the absent children. They exist because of a previous plot line but they don't fit into the current plot. So the author finds a convenient way to disappear them, like having babies born early so that they have to remain in the hospital while mom is off doing her thing. Maybe I'm being unfair, but it seems overly convenient.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 6:06 pm

You probably aren't being unfair. In some ways I think RM's books are YA with grown ups and sex. Once you have the sex kids are going to be there.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 6:32 pm

Ok now I am at 86% and there looking for ysabel's son Pagiel. He has been doing raids on the human world. Stealing food and stuff which he thinks is an act of good. In a way yes but they don't want him to do it. Anyway I have to say this now but I want to make a prediction. I think this boy is the boy in the prophecy and not eug's son. I am problay so wrong but in my mind I keep thinking he's the one that they should be worried about.

I'll give my 2nd half of my review when I finish and I'll let you know if I was right or not.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 8:44 pm

I have to get this out before I sit and write my conclusion. The ending to me laft me feeling happy and wronged at the same time. You'll see why when I write up what happened.. ugh!
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 9:04 pm

and.... I\'m waiting lol No, really I want you to explain!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 9:14 pm

Almost done.. Don't panic.. lol
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 9:16 pm

The second part of this will be alot longer because so much happend in the last 200 pages. So brace yourself for a long read..

They finally get the men to come around except Dorian. Then she remembers he needs to be talked to and given a reason to want to come back. She tells him how sorry she is and how she understands his motives for sending her to get the iron crown and says she needs him in her life and in her children's lives. The next morning she wakes and Dorian is awake. Yay! Although that stupid fox wanted to just say forget Dorian cause he might not come back out of his stooper but eug was not hearing any of that. Then they head on to the yew land and get picked up by Varia which I call the evil queen. She locks up everyone and brings eug to discuss how to end what's going on. She wants the iron crown to gain more lands and she will stop the winter storm stuff if she gives in. Eug says no. Now she's locked back up but she has a plan. She keeps sending volusian back and forth threw the walls to send Dorian messages and each time he comes back Dorian's messages are sweet and it's so laughable that he has to repeat how Dorian misses eug. Lol also this yew land is we're volusian is from and where he was cursed. I am a little nervous about him. There connection isn't at it's best in those lands and if he were to break free...

She's summond to the evil queens bedroom and the witch is freaking out because all of her and Dorian's people have gone missing. Dorian comes in and the bitch threatens to kill him if she doesn't give up the iron crown. The guard starts beating on Dorian. she was sent back to her room and there was a rat in her food. It was kiyo. A rat perfect discription of him. They discuss the plan to break out and he says he will save dorian when the time comes. then he goes back rat and leaves the room back in the food tray.

Guards come for her just before she gets ready to break out and tell her to come say goodbye to Dorian because the tortures have gone a little to far and he's about to die. If she gives the IC then they will save him. Maybe. She freaks and starts using her own magic. Then the gang bust in and a fight begins but eug needs to go find the objects that are spelled and holding the lands under the winter curse. Her and jasmine set off to release the other monarch prisoners. Hoping if there all together they can work there magic together. They get to the spelled objects but the chant won't work and the bitch queen shows up and says you have to be from the yew land for the spell to work. Then she realizes that volusian can say it. She summons him and he wants to kill the bitch queen worse then he wants to kill eug. He says her mother and grandmother made him the way he is and then he says the spell to uncurse the objects just as the bitch banishes him to the underworld to never return.

Then she starts her assault or eug and jasmine and then something flies out of the pile of objects and cracks her in the head and kills her. The object was something that Dorian gave as a gift and eug looks up and there is Dorian! He saved them!! Yay!

Volusions story was a love story. He loved the younger daughter and she loved him. The grandmother wanted his power and said if he helped them he and the other daughter could marry. When he retuned the girl was married off and had killed herself. He turned to the black arts destroying everything he could and got the name slayer of souls. Then they captured him and tuned him into what we new him as.

They head back and eug has a talk with kiyo. She hoped there time dealing with everything would change his mind about the babies. He wants the kids dead. She asks him if there is anything that can convince him that his son is a person with a right to live and not some pawn of destiny? He doesn't answer but says we won't stop looking for them. She tell him that he'll be looking forever. I really hate that piece of shit.

Her and Dorian finally had a moment and I thought they were finally going to seal the deal so to speak but interrupted again. Damn it! Roland comes and says ysabels son is raiding and Dorian and eug have his family summoned. They deny deny deny but dorian wants him held if he returns and they say his power is to great and they don't know if they can. They are dismissed and eug and Dorian go off to discuss stuff in private and while there talking he once again tells her that there isn't anything he wouldn't do for her. She of course is being stubborn and he becomes sad and says he has tried to make up for the IC incident but he quesses it will never happen and she will never trust him but she drops to her knees in front of him and says she does trust him and then they finally finally get busy. With no interruptions.

Of course that doesn't last when jasmine and Pagiel little sister knocks on the door. The sister says she over heard her mother and grandmother talking how pagiel is growing stronger and doing the things he's does without being aware of what or why he's doing it and remember my prediction? Well by 1% later it's said that ysabels father was storm born and that means her son is the first grandchild. Which when they started thinking on it that's why they all shared a likeness. Dorian started dating ysabel because she looked so much like eug. They should because they are related. I can't believe I was correct and I can't believe it took me so long to see it. There were so many signs.

Now all eug can think of is if kiyo knows the truth maybe he won't try to kill her babies anymore and they can have a life free of everything. Can't blame her there.

The word spread about pagiel being the true first born grandson and then kiyo showed up. He said he was going to stop pagiel and eug said she wanted to try to talk to him first. She said she didn't want to have to kill him. Of course kiyo said that he would stop her. He was going to kill him. End of story. The bastard never even said he was sorry for what he put her through or even if acknowledges his children. He just left on a mission. God I don't think I've read a book where I've hated someone as bad as I've hated that piece of shit and I've read a lot of damn books.

Dorian hasn't said anything the whole time. He was with her in wanting to stop the raids because he said he wanted whatever made her happy basically. Then now eug is concerned that he might change his mind knowing what he supported has already been started. She asks him if he was going to help her try to talk sense into pagiel or give him an army. He says he will stand with her and support her but she's not buying it. He says to trust him.

Eug and jasmine found pagiel and they talked him into going back together to talk about things. To work it out as a family. They head over to the otherworld and then the shit hits the fan. There attacked and pagiel thinks they set him up. He takes jasmine and eug and Dorian go looking for him. They find him and Dorian incases him in stone to hold him but they kiyo comes and tries to kill him. A little more battle and then pagiel drops suffocating dying from not being able to breath but they can't see anyone using magic on him and eug still has kiyo trapped so he can't kill him. Then pagiel stops struggling. Storm kings heir is dead.

The killer walks out of the woods and it's Maiwenn. The willow queen bitch! Eug calls a storm to kill her but she spells jasmine and says if her and kiyo don't go free jasmine will die. So they let them go.

She finally gets ready to head back to the human world to get ready to get her babies and Dorian says the most sweetest thing to her. I just love him. I may just change my quote on the bottom.

While she's out shopping kiyo finds her and tells her that Maiwenn may still be after her son. She thinks the prophecy may just go right over to the next grandson but he said he wouldn't be hunting her kid anytime soon and that he debated on telling her this for a long time and then he drops a big bomb and says.....

"Eugenie... I'm not the father of your children. Dorian is."

Holy Shit!!!! He says he had a vasectomy. That's why he knows the kids weren't his. He said that after getting Maiwenn pregnant and they started dating and they thought they would be together for a long time he didn't want any unplanned pregnancies to insure the storm born prophecy. She asked why he would tell her now after all this time or any of it at all. He said it was the right thing to do now that the threat is over.. For now anyway. He still wanted her to be careful for her kids because people are still scared of her and would use the kids as leverage against her. Then he walked away. Wow! What a turn of events.

She finally goes to see her babies. She then sit's by there cribs deciding what she will do. She loves dorian and wants to be with him but she does not want to tell him right now about the babies being his. She decides to leave the babies with the family that has been taking care of them and will visit them when she can. She wants them to have a normal life away from all the things that can happen in the otherworld. She goes back to Dorian and they end up together but she does not tell him he is the father of the twins. She said she may tell him sooner rather then later because he was to irresistible to keep the truth from but she would do it when she chose to and for no other reason.

As you can see that is why I am so divided. Happy that her and Dorian will be together. Happy that Dorian is the father. Happy the twins are safe with people who love them and will protect them. Sad because Dorian dosen't know those kids are his. Which you would think with the other reason it would out weigh the sadness but it dosent..

And that concludes Starbrites tale of Shadow Heir.. LOL
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:00 pm

Yay Starbrites cheers Thanks again hugs
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:09 pm

Your Welcome! Actually I had alot of fun doing that. So lame. lol Really though as much as her books bothered me and pissed me off and had me wanting to shoot flames. I loved every minute of reading it..
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:42 pm

What Eugenie did to Dorian was unforgiveable at the end. It's not that I don't understand her reasoning for not telling Dorian, but if you BREAK UP and PUNISH (by cheating with you ex-lover)someone over dishonesty and lack of communication, don't you think you should set the same standards for yourself? The heroine is a total hypocrite.

OK, I waited like a MONTH to say that.

I hate the fact at the end she says, maybe I will or won't tell Dorian. She is decides her own destiny. What a selfish bitch. Poor Dorian. He deserves so much better.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:07 pm

Starbites considering this is the final book in the series, did you feel the book gave you some closure?

I felt like things were left unfinished. I thought Kiyo and Maiwinn should have died horrible deaths and they get away. The biggest villians in the series live to see another day. Dorian is left unknowing about the children and even though Eugenie goes back to Dorian their relationship still felt iffy...like she still didn't know whether or not she truly loved Dorian back.

I do agree the first half was boring and seriously the heroine goes fishing?!? She finally leaves the snoozefest and then the second half really picked up. Never saw the plot twist coming and was saddened by Paigel's death...and also disturbed by the incest. Ew...

Which also reminds me that Jasmine doesn't get a very happy ending, because she was in a romantic relationship with her half nephew who ends up getting killed. No love for Jasmine.

Volusian dies. He was one of my favorite characters!

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:42 am

Honestly.. No!

I was happy that her and Dorian seemed to be ok and that it looked like they were going to be together. I was Happy that the twins were born and not killed. But really I was sad that she would just think it was ok NOT to tell him he was there father. She new how bad he wanted those babies to be his. Even if they were not his he still wanted to be a dad to them. To love them and take care of them. It really pissed me off that she was not going to tell him and the fact that we never know if he finds out those babies are his really irks me. I was hoping for a epilogue. You know something like 15 yrs ahead that gave us some insite as to maybe what happened and how things faired. When she new the story was at the end and there would be no more is it really to much to ask to give us a little bit more knowledge into what the future held for all of them???

I too thought they should have died. There were atleast 2 chances to kill kyio and it didn't happen. That willow bitch should not have been allowed to live. I felt awful that Paigel died as well. I really thought Dorian and Eug and Jasmine had a good chance at talking to him and changing things.

I was really disappointed that Eug just ups and leaves her children with that couple. Not that I didn't think they were great but to just kind of walk away like that. I get that she has to be at the otherworld but damn. The shit with her and trusting Dorian though. She kept at him about lies and blah blah blah but then she does it to him but as far as I am concerned her lie is worse then anything he has ever done to her.

I was damn glad that Kyio was not the father of those babies! He just pissed me off at every turn through out this series and she kept running on back to him like he was some damn prize.

HAHAHAHAHA! I almost forgot about the fishing and she didn't even catch anything good..

I know poor Jasmine.. That girl just can't catch a break.

There is alot of questions that need answered. Which is why i suggest all writers who are ending a series need to give us an epilogue..

Now I now I sound like a hypocrite when I say that as mad as I am about this book and a lot of shit that went down I loved it too. I honest to god think that it was Dorian that made me love these books cause I hated Kyio and Willow Bitch, I hated the way Eug acted more then half the time. Running back and forth and not knowing what she wanted. Blah Blah Blah but Dorian I just loved his character and that made me love the books. He needs his own book!!

Volusion was awesome! That was probably the one thing I was surprised that she did wrap up so nicely was his little background. I was also very happy for rurik and shaya. In love and married..
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 9:52 am

Mad I have to say this series started out with such promise and ended with me very Mad

RM made Eugiene into the biggest hypocrite! All along we read how she couldn't trust Dorian blablabla. The guy who over and over again helped her and risked himself time and time again,and RM decides its the way to go,end the book and not tell Dorian he's a father!!!!!!!!!!!

I am going to give it 1 star, 2 at the most! Seriuosly how can we as readers be ok with the ending,she doesn't desrve Dorian! And to keep his children a secret is my breaking point with RM! In my head Dorian gets the twins protects them and kicks Eugiene's ass to the curb!


Last edited by kimba on Wed Dec 28, 2011 7:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ferdy



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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 9:53 am

Ok here are my thoughts on Shadw Heir/Dark Swan series, I just copied this from a post that I just put on Goodreads Shadow Heir thread:

I just skimmed through it today.. I do need to read it properly but I don't if I'll bother because what I read was dissapointing.
Kiyo and Maiwenn don't get their comeuppance, I wanted them to suffer..ugh..Kiyo shows no guilt, regret or remorse after everything he's done and he acts so holier than thou and as if he's done nothing wrong.. do we even know if Kiyo was genuinely interested in Eug or did Maiwenn send him.. because it didn't even seem like he had any feelings for her. Did he love Maiwenn all that time??
Eug leaving her kids and not telling Dorian that they were his.. WTF!!! She is such a hypocritcal cow, an awful human being..I hate her after reading the last chapter and was I supposed to sympathise with her 'reasoning' for deciding not to tell Dorian..because I couldn't AT ALL. We never find out if she does tell him.. and if she does tell him how can their relationship survive that?? If by some miracle he does forgive her their relationship will change and there'll be a lot of bitterness, resentment and distrust.. how is that a happy ending.. how is that closure.
I wasted my time and money on this series.. only to be left to try and fill in the blanks myself. It's like RM writes about a something huge that we want addressing/resolving but she just brushes it under the carpet because she can't be bothered.. Why write about Kiyo's betrayl and not have a showdown or a some sort of resoluton that will satisfy the readers??
Another thing which annoyed me was Eug's relationship with her mum and Roland.. They abandoned her when she was raped multiple times because they were disappointed that she wanted her rapist dead.. WTF?! how could a parent punish their already traumatised child for that.. If I went through that and my parents turned their back on me.. I don't think I could ever forgive them and if we did make up it would damage/change our relationship forever.. I know Roland was there for her when Kiyo was chasing her but it wasn't enough for me, I wanted Roland and her mum to apologize to Eug for not being there when she needed them most.
I hate Eug for denying Dorian a chance to be a father.. something he so desperately wanted he was willing to raise children that weren't even his.
How could she leave her kids so easily.. I didn't feel her torment.. she just seemed a little upset like she was giving up her fave pair of shoes. I alao noticed the characters that I like Dorian, Jasmine and Volusian all had sh*t happen to them.. I don't count Dorian ending up with Eug a good thing for him.. he should have got to raise or be a part of his kids lives.
I've noticed that I find all RM's heroine are more likeable at the start of the series than at the end.. they turn into cheaters, liars and selfish idiots. I don't mind heroine's making mistakes but they have to redeem themselves somehow not just sail of into the sunset because they've got their happy ending.. and they never think twice about the damage they've done to anyone else or how other people don't have their happy ending thanks to them.
If RM starts a new series I don't think I'll buy it until the series has finished and I've read reviews that show that there is a satisfying conclusion for her readers. Unfortunately I've already read Bloodlines so I'll have to keep buying those but I have feeling that she'll end Bloodlines without given closure to all the charcters we care about.. I think Sydney towards the end of the series will become like the rest of her heroines. Phew sorry for the long rant, had a lot to get of my chest:P
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:00 am

OK. I think I read up to chapter 10. Yes parts are very boring, but I was kinda spoiler-ed so I am trying to get to the parts with the babies, Kiyo and Dorian. I also love that she realizes that Dorian may actually love her and isn't only there for the prophesy and power. MMMMppphhhffff. Stupid stupid girl. Go to Dorian not that stupid fox...I just want to know the the paternity of the babies because I don't buy that they are both or even one the fox's. Hoping for at least one as Dorian's.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 6:55 pm

Ferdy now tell us how you really feel Wink I have brought the book its sitting on my kindle and I am just feeling I don't want to waste the time. Seems bad enough I wasted the money. I did hope that it would be better. Thinking this is the end of the road with the series for a few readers. I will eventually read it, but from the reviews no need to hurry.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:04 pm

We need some serious fan fic to fix the stupid ending. Anyone? thinking
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ferdy



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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:05 pm

LOL.. I get really riled up Mad when reading books that don't resolve and address issues that have been introduced.. Why bother writing about person A betraying/abandoning/using/hurting person B and then have person B either forget about it or just let it go for no good reason.. grrr..I shoudln't become so emotionally involved in books but I can't seem to help it.. When a character/storyline pisses me off in a book I find it difficult to go to sleep for a few days because the characters/storylines douchery just plays on my mind.
I'm really disappointed in RM.. I like her writing and world building but the story and characters she writes in the latter half of her series are just a huge let down especially when their so much potential for the characters/story to step up and shine. I've not got high hopes for Bloodlines.. I was disappointed in VA because they were a lot of issues unresolved esp the whole dhampir slavery and second class status which was shoved in our faces throughout the series but yet we don't see any change.. I initally thought Bloodlines would show the first steps of dhampirs moving away form servitude but the series just seems to be about protecting Jillian, Sydney changing her views about moroi and the world of the alchemists.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:12 pm

http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/750810

Ferdy, I think this is the thread you were refering to. I also commented, but under someone else's review.

This was my take on the ending:

It's ok to have a surprise ending if you can justify why it happened. In this case, it was like a car wreck. You walk away thinking, did that just happen? OMG, I can't believe that happened! Once you're over the shock of it, you feel like crap. It made no sense.

As for it being the final book in the series, one would have thought there would be more closure. I didn't feel like the journey was complete. There was no satisfaction when you finish. Eugenie makes decisions and then states a disclaimer she can always change her mind.

I don't respect the heroine now and am left wondering, what was the point?
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:16 pm

It's double insulting that she didn't tell Dorian he was the father and she left them without giving him a choice. We all know Dorian loves children and how hurt he was when he found out she was pregnant with someone elses kids. He still wanted them. I hate the ending! I'm so happy I didn't read this book. Thanks again for telling me Starbrites smile
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:22 pm

Ferdy, you bring up a really good point about emotional investment. When an author provokes emotions when you read their work, is it considered exceptionally good writing?

I wondered about that because my book club seemed to think that the story was very well written and dealt with complex issues. It left you thinking.

To me, I felt the plotting was poor. Simply because if a writer takes you on a journey, there should be a destination. I felt that I paid for the ticket, but I didn't go anywhere. I didn't think the heroine truly accomplished anything, so I was left feeling frustrated.

I didn't like the pacing, because I was so impatient to get to the parts I was really interested in, like Kiyo, Dorian and the fairy world. The human world really didn't interest me. The heroine wasn't even that invested. All her actions said otherwise, including leaving her newborn premature babies behind.

If RM was truly trying to accomplish the struggle of dealing with both worlds and finding balance, I don't think Eugenie got it. There is still a struggle. Her problems aren't really resolved. Yes, I feel bad, but more like emotional manipulation and teasing, rather than a profound conclusion that left me thinking, yeah it's unfair but I get it.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Swan   Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:27 pm

Hopsngrapes Yea that is the thread I was referring to. I've come to the conclusion there is no point, I disliked Eug for the many stupid things she's done in the series but I truly despise her for taking away Dorian's chance to be a dad.. even if she does deign to tell him when their teenagers, he's lost out on seeing them grow and teaching them things as children and shaping them into who they'll grow up to be.. for the fae (and most humans) children are more precious, treasured and loved than teenagers because they are so rare and to deprive Dorian of loving his offsping when their babies/toddlers/kids - to see them when their completely innocent, wide eyed and sweet is just disgusting Mad
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Dark Swan
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